When you look at Nacho Carbonell’s work, you’re taken into another world. Organic shapes and unique materials, his works are tactile and intimate, alive and engaging, an extension of the person interacting with them. Browsing through his collection, one realizes they have seen nothing else like it because it’s quintessentially Nacho and the way he sees the world, harking back to his childhood summers scuba diving on the coast of Spain. One doesn’t encounter straight lines or traditional form but rather a playful and bold expression of a creative mind. Born in Spain but based in the Netherlands, Carbonell launched his career after graduating from the Design Academy Eindhoven. And now his work has been exhibited in major museums across the globe, is collected and he is now on the roster of prominent designers at Carpenters Workshop Gallery.
Nacho Carbonell:
I feel like for me, design it’s a tool that help us understand better the time we live in. I mean, I feel like when we look at design, we can really see what is happening and what will happen in our near future. And it would it have happened in the past.
Arkitektura:
That’s artist and designer Nacho Carbonell, and this is Design in Mind. A podcast series from Arkitektura. Arkitektura has been a hub for international designers and brands in America for over three decades. My name is Arkitektura, and Design in Mind candidly explores the lives and work of some of the most inspiring designers and design thinkers from around the world.
When you look at Nacho Carbonell’s work, you’re taken into another world. Organic shapes and unique materials. His works are tactile and intimate, alive, and engaging. An extension of the person interacting with them. Browsing through his collection, one realizes they’ve never seen anything else like it because it’s quintessentially Nacho and the way he sees the world. In part harking back to his childhood summers, scuba diving on the coast of Spain. One doesn’t encounter straight lines or traditional form, but rather playful and bold expression of a creative mind.
Born in Spain, but based in the Netherlands, Carbonell launched his career after graduating from the Design Academy Eindhoven, and now his work has been exhibited in major museums across the globe, is collected, and he’s now on the roster of prominent designers at Carpenters Workshop Gallery, amongst other things. Despite the pandemic, Carbonell and the studio have grown, and for this interview, we spoke on Zoom, where he walked me through a few of the works in the space. We started the conversation speaking about his upbringing and his family coming from traditional professions, a doctor and a lawyer. I wondered if Nacho felt an expectation to follow on the same path. Apparently not.
Nacho Carbonell:
I did not really feel certain pressure at the beginning. Later on, a bit more when actually I needed to make my choices in life. I felt like, okay, creativity, as in the art form, I know from my father probably was quite a scareable kind of thing like, “Oh, you become an artist, you are going to die of hunger.” And my mum was a bit more open and liberal on that, but also a bit worried because, of course, I need to fit somewhere. And that’s, I feel, a common worry from the parents for the kids. So I thought design when I just introduced design education in my house. I feel it was more accepted because it was more of a kind of career that you could kind of become a kind of a designer of objects that they could be mass-produced.
And it was more of a kind of the perception, I think for my father mainly, it was more of an architect, but of objects, no. So it must have been more kind of a safety in that just to say like, “Oh, an artist.” It’s kind of this kind of blurry figure, no, of someone. So on that sense, I kind of basically convinced them to say, I think this is something for me. I really remember my father telling me, “Look, I mean, we know that you are not a great student, but this education is going to be expensive. So you have two choices. You really take this opportunity and make the best out of it, or I give you the money, and you do whatever. You open a business, or you do whatever you want with the money.” But make sure,” he said, “you use it wisely.”
And then, by the end really had that need to take the money because I feel like I just immediately fall in love with this career, and I pass from being one of the worst students in the class to be one of the best and most motivated. And I never wanted the day to end. I was completely taken by the situation. I couldn’t believe that actually, I was just missing out for 20 years of my life this aspect of myself. And I couldn’t believe after three years studying industrial design in Valencia. Then it was over. Then I was kind of like… I was a designer, but I couldn’t believe that. I couldn’t kind of feel myself. I was formed enough to kind of, I don’t know, get the role of what I thought was a designer.
So I just looked for a second experience abroad, and I looked for a different school where actually also they will kind of give me different insights of what is the figure of a designer. And I just ended up in the Design Academy where actually the education as I thought, or the concept of being a designer, as I thought that before, or as I was teach before in my previous school, was a completely new approach. It’s very different. So was less methodologic. Was a lot more open and, I think, very personal. So I was really lost there. And so, all of a sudden, I again became the black sheep in the class because I was completely lost. So I was not that great a student when I arrived to the Design Academy, but I was highly, highly, highly motivated.
I just wanted to understand why I couldn’t fit any more into this kind of concept of designer when actually I was fitting so well in there in my previous school. So I just tried to kind of adapt. So I went into a kind of very introspective trip on figuring out who I am as a designer and what am I doing here? And what do I want to transmit with my designs? So again, from being very kind of a controller of objects, I just became kind of basically myself, the object. The subject to talk about. So I feel that’s just when my prayers, they start becoming very personal. Everything was talking about my relationship with my environment, with my context, and actually with my roots. And being actually out of Spain, it allow me to kind of look at myself as I never did before and look at from where I’m coming from and from where are my ideas can be inform.
My fascinations. Why do I like so much idea of the tactility? I just grew up next to the seaside. And I spent my childhood and my summers with my grandparents, scuba diving, diving, hunting for octopus and it was everything about the sea, who was just play a very important role and here in this academic location I was trying to bring all that aspect up and yeah, for me, it was a great, interesting experience that kind of lead me to who I am also a bit today.
Arkitektura:
It’s fascinating. So you said that you went on a trip to really find out. Did you go on a physical trip? Did you go somewhere when to really find out who am I and what do I want to do or was it like a mental trip?
Nacho Carbonell:
I was in the trip. It was a mental trip. It was kind of a rediscovering. I mean, I move already from Valencia to Eindhoven, so the physical trip was done. Now I just landed into this new universe, but to be able to speak about what are my interests, I needed to kind of look inside me. So the introspective trip was really just being here with myself and trying, try and error, try and error, try and error, for two and a half years. And was very intense. Was extremely intense but worthwhile.
Arkitektura:
I’m sure there were moments where you doubted yourself? I mean, we’re there? How did you work through the difficult moments in that process? I mean, it’s so hard to remember now, I’m sure, but…
Nacho Carbonell:
Actually, with quite some humor. I couldn’t believe that I couldn’t really make anything that it was cool. That it was nice. That, I mean because I put so much energy. I mean, and I could see also my other classmates, my other colleagues really being able to kind of express themselves with such a simple exercises. And I was very jealous about it because, I mean, I just worked my ass off during the whole week trying and trying and trying, but it never came out. So it was really frustrating to kind of see I couldn’t manage to kind of communicate and do what I really wanted to do, or that my object itself, it couldn’t really transmit that then.
And I was learning a lot from my Japanese friends, and they could really play in this. The legacy in all their objects and it was beautiful. Everything that they touch, they kind of turn into an object of desire. And then anyone… I was there. I was really looking and learning from each of the students and me. I was just frustrated. Over and over, but frustrated. But happily frustrated. Finally, frustrated. I just felt like, “Okay, it will come.”
Nacho Carbonell:
… Frustrating. I just felt like, “Okay, it will come. It will come.” I remember after my first semester, one of my mentors that I will always remember, he really made me change as well the way of seeing objects. It was He saw me working and failing so hard that actually he just told me, “I think that you should pack your things and go to a different educational school, like maybe like in Italy and become kind of like this industrial designer that you have been trained to become. Because here, I only see you may be able to get frustrated and you may only be a frustrated designer. And I don’t like to see you like that.” But I told him, “Look, I just came here to learn on how you see the things.”
I was really astonished. To, I just could kind of like hear him talk for hours. And I said, “I just want to see the things how you see them, with my own eyes.” To be so analytic, to understand the worlds around me and then to kind of like being able to analyze it as you guys do.” So he told me like, “I might be wrong. You may make the click and then you might make it. But, if you don’t make that click, at least don’t get frustrated.” So I took this into account and I said, “Okay, let’s do it.” It can’t do worse than this. I just only can grow and improve. And it was like really two years later and many kinds of failures … Also, while I was graduating, I tried to do it and I fail again, very, very strongly.
But then, because I was also trying to absorb too much from external opinions. And I felt like actually my projects, they were becoming kind of a collage of different mentors that I had at that time. I couldn’t defend it. So in my final graduation, what I did I just closed myself at that time in my studio, that was inside an abandoned church. And I say, “Okay, I’m not going to see anyone. I just want to go to what I think is right.” I’s supposed to be a designer by now. So whoever needs to fail now are my ideas and my way of doing things. And six months of really, really introspective trip on where actually the only thing that matter at that time was my work.
And then to spend like 10 hours every day, like physically producing this idea of, for example, symbiosis. That had been kind of like the core essence of my project, of my work is still today. And working, working, working, working, working until the day before I just needed to present. I just got the internal panic attack because I just kind of like created this monster. I was like, “This Pump It Up, I call it.” That was this sitting element that you sit on it and then some animals inflate next to it. It was talking about their relationship with each other. They have like an object and you belonging to the object. And when I saw this, I felt like, “Wow, this is so weird. I never see anything like that.” So I kind of like felt like this panic attack.
No one was doing something like that. All my colleagues, they were doing such beautiful objects, and this was kind of like a bit of a ugly monster. But after I tried it a couple of times and I saw it working, I thought, “I don’t know. It might not be the most beautiful thing, but it’s doing everything I want it to do.” It’s engaging the user with the object. It’s really creating a relationship in matter of seconds. And it’s talking about who I am, what do I care? It’s talking about the circle of life, it’s talking about the colors I like. I mean, it was me. So I thought, “Okay. This is it.” I went to bed, I overslept for my final presentation. But finally I went, I made it, I presented and it was a big whoa, and a big surprise for me and for my mentors.
Arkitektura:
Yeah. They loved it.
Nacho Carbonell:
Everyone loved that. I feel like at the beginning then no one knew like what to think about it, because it was a big surprise. I didn’t really like show very much my purpose, because I didn’t want it to be kind of like interfere by any other thing. I was really sensitive at the moment. It’s just, you are kind of like you didn’t hatch yet, so any opinion could kind of like crush you. So I just let myself … to kind of like hatch myself. That day actually is also when there at that time, the directors of the school just came. And for the first time, just talked to me and they was very intrigued about the object. I think that also she loved it and she kind of took it under her arms and actually helped me a lot to kind of like bring it out to a big major public. And that’s how my career started.
Arkitektura:
What year was that?
Nacho Carbonell:
That was 2007.
Arkitektura:
So 13 years ago?
Nacho Carbonell:
13 years ago.
Arkitektura:
So you were 27 years old?
Nacho Carbonell:
I was 27.
Arkitektura:
Yeah. How confident did you become in yourself after that? How were you able to access that confidence? Was it more easily accessible? Because, you had struggled so much. Can you imagine, you’re failing, your mentor tells you, “You should quit.” Honestly, go back to whatever it was you were doing. You don’t usually hear that mentors say that. Usually, they say, “Look, forget about the failures. You’re great, you can do this.” That’s what mentors usually … Unless they’re kind of doing this to trick you, to be like, “Okay, forget it.” Then they’re wanting to challenge you.
Nacho Carbonell:
Yeah. But it depends also how it’s presented to you, or introduced. At that time, his words, for example, they were touch, but very direct and very honest, as well. So I feel like I didn’t take it as a bad thing, I took it as I kind of like opening my eyes. I’m like, “Okay. Yeah, it’s true here.” I’m not clicking. So I just say, “Okay.” What is just stuck into my mind, it needs to click. Something has to click, something needs to change. I need to kind of learn how to look at the world with my own eyes. That’s just only about training.
Arkitektura:
And trust.
Nacho Carbonell:
I just need needed training. One of my biggest fears when I started design is I didn’t know how to draw.
Arkitektura:
Yes.
Nacho Carbonell:
Zero. I was in a panic that I don’t know how to draw. How can I become a designer if I don’t know how to draw? And then I learned that actually drawing is also technique. That you sit there and see something that was perspective, and then you do this, and you do that. And in the end, from not knowing how to do anything, to start knowing how to make it. How to train your vision was a bit more maybe challenging. It’s not like a manual, or a guide for that. But with my highly motivated brain, I just thought like, “Okay, let’s try, let’s do it.”
Arkitektura:
Yeah. To what extent were you scared of failing your father, or your family? Was it to come home with your head hung low and say, “Okay, it didn’t work out.” Was that at all a motivator?
Nacho Carbonell:
It could also be motivator. But I felt like at that time I didn’t want to let myself down. I just really wanted to say, “I started this, I want to end it. I want to finish it.” It was important for me. It was relevant. You also kind of like you are in this comfort zone. I already graduated as a designer, so I kind of … And I was very good on that. So I always can go back to this, but I want to go a step farther. Go a bit beyond and to kind of like walk a path that is still unknown to me. I felt like, “Okay. let’s do it.” I think also later on, even more scary, or more difficult to kind of like convince maybe your family the path that you choose is a completely unknown path …
Like doing things with yourself, by yourself and becoming a designer of that type. I don’t know how, and who’s going to buy these and who’s going to support it, and which market exists.
Because at that time, most of the market is … for this type of objects it didn’t really existed, or it was just like also being born. And so everything was so new, for me, for my family, for everyone. But, I had the opportunity also to kind of get into a few competitions and I won one of the competition. That gave me like a bit of money to kind of start up my thing. I was having a church I was paying zero money. So basically, I had no much cost. So I say, “I need a bit more time.” And of course, your family comes with all these great ideas of how you could do merchandising and how you could do this thing. And you should present this to this company and they’re like getting royalties. So, everyone that doesn’t even know how the thing works, but because they care about you, they try to kind of like convince you the way …
Nacho Carbonell:
Works but because they care about you, they try to convince you the way that you should be able to cash something from your passion. But because my level of expanding it was so low, I could say, “No. I’m going to keep my passion running and let’s see how later on maybe we can cash something from it.” So, I gained some time until things slowly get rolling.
Arkitektura:
Well, you were saying that Pump It Up was Pump It Up?
Nacho Carbonell:
Yes.
We think about our relationship to objects in the emotional sense like what the importance that we’ve imbued upon something because the memories that we have with it.
Arkitektura:
Yeah. There’s a place here called Pump It Up where kids have parties and they jump on bouncy things. And I hate that play. I was like, “Oh, we can’t go to Pump It Up?” But I love Pump It Up as a concept of your piece because of that symbiosis and our relationship to an object and how it… We think about our relationship to objects in the emotional sense like what the importance that we’ve imbued upon something because the memories that we have with it.
But we don’t necessarily think about it in our physical sense like how something has held us physically and has formed to us physically or is an extension of our physical selves. And so, I think that taking it to that level I think is really just so interesting because it makes all these things that you make, if that’s still the true line. If you still believe in that, which I think you just said you do, then everything is so profoundly personal. And yeah. I don’t-
Nacho Carbonell:
I think the things that become personal when we have an interest for it as well. And I feel like this idea of desire. I mean, at that time was when I was splitting Pump It, I was a bit even annoyed that they say, they were like, “We always desire the object. We always desire something.” I like the object was not desiring you so how to oppose this thing or how to create a bit of a relationship. And that only happened sometimes or mostly with someone whose response to you.
And also I wanted to create that respond between an object and a human being. And but because human beings, we are all the time somehow the siren something or and they get the… They say, they’ll be like, “Something that has no value or so can become very valuable to you.” I always put this example of this old t-shirt that you have and you always wear and you love for a certain reason. You make you feel super powerful. The value of this t-shirt is serum probably but it’s broken, it’s falling apart and but it made you feel good.
So, how can we arrive to that comfort with our objects? Or how can we arrive to that emotional attachment to the objects. And then, that’s has been always my fascination. And then to create this patina, this relationship with an object, I feel like if we achieve that, I feel like we will have objects that we will take care for the rest of our lives. And that’s the [00:25:30] type of interaction that I’m always looking for.
I mean, sometimes of course unfortunately, this t-shirt that one day disappear from your drawer and then you understood that your mother just scattered in a few pieces to be able to clean the surfaces of your house and then your heart is broken because you, yeah, you don’t have your magical t-shirt anymore. But that’s a a memory that I also have. No idea. This magic icons that they are being lost and you always try to later on recreate them and find them again.
Arkitektura:
Did you actually have a t-shirt that was really valuable to you that your mom cut? Did that actually happen?
Nacho Carbonell:
I remember this story is a true story like see it the level of going to in some table finding that my t-shirt was cut in pieces to be able to mop things. And I’m like, “What did do you do with that? And why?” “Yeah. It was so old and creepy and crabbier.” Well, like, “No. No. No,” so. But I always find a new little new objects. I actually, I find myself always finding things on the scuba diving or by walking in somewhere that [00:27:00] caught my attention.
And somehow, I use them as almost this little precious treasure that he’s going to give me something. And then you look at it and from this tiny found of day can really grow a huge collection. Know it sparkle the imagination and open the door to a place that you never imagined that you will you go. You know?
Arkitektura:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Nacho Carbonell:
But. So, I always look for clues. I’m someone that is always searching.
Arkitektura:
So, after Pump It Up… And I don’t actually like speaking about specific pieces because I think people can come and see those pieces. But it seems to have given you the freedom to just completely allow yourself to create things that are very you. I mean, I look at the collection and I’m just like, “Wow, this is… You’re really incredible.” I mean, you are because there’s so… First of all, they feel so visceral. They feel so human. I mean, look at this. Everything feels so organic and-
Nacho Carbonell:
I mean, they’re human. They are alive. We spent so much time with these objects. I inject them with so much love and care and time. And now, we work with 10 people here in the studio and we all… I mean, it’s just really about being passionate and really working together to that… Inject them with life. I mean, we want them to see… I mean, we talk to them about them as our creation, our babies. They are more than an object. And then, we spent infinite amount of hours with them. And so, at the end they copy basically our character, our personalities and they need to be alive because they’re being created that way.
Arkitektura:
Yeah. I was thinking about, you’re making this piece for this home in San Francisco and how are you going to… It’s just going to… I was wondering if it was difficult to see it go away.
Nacho Carbonell:
I had so much troubles before on this thing of letting them go. I couldn’t. I mean, it was like this attachment that I couldn’t really overcome this connection that I had with them. But I think later on you start maturing and then the pieces they start mature and then they ask for this independency. And then, I love and I enjoy it to really spend this time with them here and really creating them hand to hand. I like it because I have a feeling like they grow by themselves up there. And then they tell you how they should go.
And but once they are done, now, I just I learn it that it’s time for them to go. They had been meant to travel the world, go around, go to places that I didn’t expect. So, it’s like this fatherhood that I had before over protective at the beginning. I confronted and learn how to let it go on later on being able to travel the world and see them again and seeing them how they do, seeing them in new contexts and see them feed into this new context as and glowing by themselves.
Because also, just see them contrasting with the word, when I say they are out of this universe, where they are being created here, everything blends with each other. So, when I just see one of these pieces outside, I see them like a standing and with a self-confidence that they didn’t maybe have here. Here they again. I feel like when we were talking about before in order to give you come from Spain and you are a Spanish in Spain, you are one more by where you are a Spanish in ninth of it, you are like, “Oh, well. This weird guy.” Is it?
Arkitektura:
Yeah. Which is great. Yeah. I mean, it’s a lot like raising children, feeling attached to them and then also then having to allow them to… I mean, not that this stage when they’re in my case, 8, 7, 4 but allowing them to let them go and see them how they be in the world. You were saying that we always desire something. I mean, and we do. I mean, we are desiring creatures. So, what are you desiring more of?
Nacho Carbonell:
I mean, for me, my biggest desire was always to create a platform as I created now here. Is this a studio where actually we can really feed ourself with new ideas and being able to like this idea just is growing next to the an all idea. And then like seeing how you grow, how it evolves and how organically, everything passed from one thing to another. So, this has been always my biggest desire and having the freedom.
Nacho Carbonell:
That’s been always my biggest desire and having the freedom to be able to create, and I need to select, we are right at the beginning of that. Somehow I like set it all for myself. Actually people allow me to have the freedom on creation. I mean, after my graduation of course, not before. After that, they were like, okay just do, just explore. I have been taking it like very easy going, but at the same time very seriously.
Arkitektura:
Yeah. I mean, your materials are unique. Is there some sort of thinking like, oh, I’m going to use my unique materials. I’m not going to, like chicken wire. I haven’t heard of another designer necessarily doing that, but maybe that’s more about my limited knowledge. What’s the thinking behind that? How does that even come into your orbit?
Nacho Carbonell:
They notice actually that the choice of materials are basically because I’m looking for things that I can manipulate myself. I have been always trying to find things like actually they are around me. That are easily accessible, that I don’t need a big machinery and complex machinery that my hands can really play with it. I mean really form the material. The mesh for example, is just something that I just found. I was okay, there, I can do it. I can work with it. And my first machine actually that I bought, it was a welding machine, this first series machine, because I felt like it would be interesting to make my, how could I reinforce this mesh, this chicken wire. And it was like that. I felt like okay, metal rods that I can bend and I can weld very easily.
And it gave me such a freedom because actually it’s a very simple machine, is on off, I mean, in a couple of speeds and that’s it. And then you chop the thing, but then all of a sudden I can bend thin [00:35:30] rods of the metal and it’s done like 3D sketching. And this concept of 3D sketching for me was amazing in the first day that I just got the machine I created this lover’s chair, like in a one man chair. There was this chair with a cocoon next to it. And it was spontaneously, I actually I just did like the sketch the night before and with that thing, I was just starting to bend the rods and then it was appearing in front of myself, like this figure of it. And I love it. I love the spontaneity of it. When I saw it in the sketch, I had no idea of the scale, but when you confront yourself with the limited tools that you have, and the limited material that you have, then your brain starts recreating this same idea and figuring out how you are going to build it.
All the materials that I choose are quite, maybe as you said, different, but they are not different for me. It’s sand. I grew up in the seaside. So just for me it’s like a primary material is paper. Because I remember I had tons of newspaper, laying in the church and I needed to recycle them. So I just did it. I always choose everything that is around me. I mean, you don’t need to go too far to collect your materials and actually sometimes your material, they give you the clues to your concept. So it’s like a beautiful dialogue.
Arkitektura:
Yeah. It’s not necessarily like you seek it out, it’s there and then you find it, it gives you ideas of what to do with it. It’s not like, “Okay, I’m going to use mesh. So I should go find mesh.” You might’ve actually found it and said, “Wow, what can I do with this?” And suddenly all this wealth of possibility opens up. So I’m going to ask one last question because it’s late for you there. And I realize that, but why do you think design is important? It’s a very strange time right now during this COVID thing. And one of the incredible things about this time is that it’s definitely forced people to really think about what’s most important to them. In San Francisco, that means a lot of people are leaving and moving it’s too expensive.
First they’re losing work, but then they’re also thinking, oh, they don’t want to have to struggle with work all the time. I should be closer to my family. People I’m living close to their family. People can’t see each other as much, so they’re really only seeing their very dearest friends. There’s all this distillation and all this introspection that’s happening. Like, what am I doing with my life? Why is it important? And who am I in this world? So why is it important? Why is design an important thing?
Nacho Carbonell:
I feel like for me design is a tool that help us understand better the time we live in. So it’s an analytical tool for what is happening around us, internalize our context, internalize our emotions, internalize our needs. I feel like when we look at design. We can really see of what is happening and what it could happen in our near future, and it wouldn’t have happened in the past. It’s good understanding it, to be able to use it like a protection to what is coming or to our ourselves.
Arkitektura:
We’re doing this big project with The Whitney, part of it is about monuments and how, and I was doing some research on monuments and public art projects. And one of the things that they said was monuments are this ability to reflect the past past and re-imagine the future. And it reminds me a little bit of what you’re saying. It’s like design is this ability to look at the past and also to envision a future. Is that true? Is that what you’re saying? Or am I wrong?
Nacho Carbonell:
I think that that’s pretty much what I’m saying. I feel like all the conversation that we had actually we just think about is about my roots, from where I’m coming from, from where I absorb my first ideas and then how I’m trying to project them into the future. How do I see what is coming for generations to come. I think I know the world is going to be the heritage I live for my kids. Again, design is this tool that help us to understand better the time we live and to try to project in the future the changes that we are going to experience.
As you can see, we cannot really predict many of the things, and that life is full of surprises, but I feel like this is really make us stronger and then make me believe that actually they desire will keep ramificating in many different disciplines. But when I’m now also teaching other descent academia and one of the most beautiful conversation on with the students, and always the question I give to them is, how do you see the future? Also even older generation that you are. I mean, you need to start projecting for your future and don’t let anyone tell you what is important for you and that’s what I hope. The new generation they’re really conscience on this. And they can really design and shape a better future for them and their future generations.
Arkitektura:
Perfect Nacho. I thank you so much for your time. That was artist and designer. Nacho Carbonell. Design in Mind is a podcast series from Architecture based in San Francisco, Architecture curates [00:43:00] the best design from around the world and makes it accessible through its retail spaces, live events and this podcast. Design in Mind is Architecture’s way of honoring the life and work of some of the best designers today and celebrating the magic and beauty of design and design thinking. Design in Mind is produced for architecture by Sound Made Public. And I’m your host Arkitektura to hear more, please visit arksf.com or go to iTunes and subscribe to Design in Mind, rate the show and tell us what you think. Thank you so much for listening.
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